The Okayplayer Interview: Ryan Leslie & The Metrics Of 'Les Is More'

There’s something about Ryan Leslie; it’s the impeccable style and savoir-faire, the manner in which he walks the fine line between self-assuredness and vulnerability that makes the ladies swoon. The seemingly effortless mastery of the production process evidenced in his frequent YouTube videos – many of which have racked up well over a million views. The unparalleled way he retains a sense of accessibility to his fan base – going as far as showing up at a Twitter follower’s house in his Lamborghini, whisking them off to a recording session. And now with the release of his third solo album, the decidedly rap-influenced Les Is More, Ryan Leslie aims to up the ante by positioning himself as both an independent artist and a smooth rhyme sayer. We recently chopped it up with R. Les about his departure from Universal Motown, the visual album concept of Les Is More, and the reason behind his rhymes.

OKP: How is your new album Les Is More a departure from your debut and sophomore efforts?

RL: In my mind, it’s really not a departure at all. Both Transitions and my self-titled album were written from a place of honesty. They were both a reflection of the experiences I was having in life at the time. This album is absolutely no different. It’s always interesting to have to describe my art. It’s like when you make a meal and having someone ask, “What’s it going to taste like?” You can talk about the spices and the process of cooking it. But at the end of the day, it’s really going to be about having someone taste it for themselves. If we were to talk about how my life experiences were different on this record and how they affected your lyrics, then I can actually speak to that. Because there’s actually something quantifiable, in that regard. But if you ask, “Why did you use more guitar” - that’s just how I felt. That’s what the expression called for. I’ve had an incredible collection of experiences that have inspired this album: touring overseas, falling in and out and in love, going through terrible breaks in relationships that I invested so much time and energy in. The more obvious difference with this album is that it’s a rap album.

OKP: What were the initial responses from people when they heard you were switching lanes?

RL: The response from lots of folks when I tell them that has been one of surprise, shock, disbelief, disdain (laughs). People saying that I shouldn’t be going in this direction, being that I just came off a Grammy-nominated album. As artists, we should always be going in the direction of honesty. That’s how I feel and that’s where I have to go. There’s nowhere else for me to go. I would say that if you look at how much of the Billboard chart is set aside for our music, it’s all lumped in together. It’s a hip-hop/ R&B chart. So, I don’t know if it’s really a departure – other than I’m just rapping more.

OKP: You mentioned previously that your experiences dropping in on some of the sessions for Kanye West and Jay-Z’s lauded collaboration album Watch The Throne were part of the inspiration for Les Is More. Can you elaborate on that?

RL: I just looked at it as the best internship that I could possibly get at my level. I’m a producer. So many times people come to me and say, “What should I do?” So for me to actually go into a session and be looking around at what I should do – just because of the level of accomplishment and cultural contribution that these guys have made – that was an amazing experience. Just to be there, watching their workflow, to watch how their teams move, to watch how their collaborative process works, to look at the creative process, the hours, the time, work ethic, and focus that is invested in every aspect of the art. Not just the making of each instrumental layer that makes up the track or each vocal layer that makes up the vocal performance. But also the ideas that swirl around with regards to the visuals as well. Also just the company of creatives. If you caught the VOYR video series, you got to see the people that were coming by to visit the sessions. From Spike Lee to Chris Rock to Jared Leto. It was creation, inspiration, and collaboration on a level that far exceeds anything that I have had the opportunity to participate in. That’s really what I took away from that experience. And from the first hand observation of one of the most monumental albums in hip-hop history being made came the forging of collaborative relationships with the likes of Raekwon, Young Jeezy, Jay Electronica. Also, the continued collaboration with artists like Fabolous. And releasing a single with Red Café and Rick Ross. These are all experiences that have shaped this record. When you look at the names that I’ve just mentioned, you look at what they’ve contributed to the art form. I think that you’ll be able to listen to my album and hear the inspiration that these artists have provided.

OKP: Your YouTube channel has done an impeccable job of cementing the Ryan Leslie brand by showcasing the idea of the very urbane, jetsetting, yet disciplined and multi-talented artist. How are you expanding on that with the visual album concept of Les Is More?

RL: Putting these videos together, I really wanted them to come from a place of reality – because I went independent. A lot of the video ideas that I have, some of which will be included on the next record that I’m planning to release in March of 2013, the budget for the creative was in the hundreds of thousands per video. For this record, because everything was really so personal and based on the life that I actually lead every single day, I just wanted to put out the footage that we were capturing as I was traveling around the world. I directed and edited everything. In directing my real life, I had to remember to slow down a bit so that whoever was with me could capture those moments. Then we could put them into records. Each one of the videos is almost a literal interpretation of the lyrics. But that’s because the visuals are what actually inspired the lyrics. By the visuals, I mean what I was experiencing and taking in as I was writing those records. I was fortunate enough to have a very dedicated team of young people who had no problem capturing everything as it unfolded. I was then able to cut those moments into the music videos. On iTunes, there are seven music videos, the live performance videos and the studio sessions bundled with the album.

OKP: In a decision that quite possibly shocked and perplexed many in the industry, you initiated a split with your record company Universal Motown after the release of your sophomore album. Being that the dream of many artists is to be a part of the major label system, what instigated your desire for a departure?

RL: There are as many unique pathways as there are success stories in the world. Each pathway correlates with the respective success story. What success represents for me is the ability for me to create in an unrestricted manner. To be able to have an unfiltered dialogue with my audience. I just found that with regard to budgets, spending, and creative ideas I had while I was at Universal, [the label] had to be cognizant of commerce. For me, the only thing that really matters is the artistic statement. So when I would sit down and talk to the executives about my video concepts - about traveling to different parts of the world and shooting videos with multi-layered plot lines - in many cases, it was met with an immediate veto. Mostly because of the costs associated traveling with a camera crew and mounting productions in various countries. They’d say, “Yo, Ryan man. Look at your sales. Look at the number of units you’re moving. How do you expect us to justify that investment in your art? From an accounting standpoint, your art doesn’t merit that kind of investment because we’re not going to get a return.” I understood where they were coming from. But for me, I would invest everything into my art. So I believe it was just a disconnect in terms of approach. A window of opportunity came when I was renegotiating for my final [album] release. They wanted to turn my deal into a 360 deal.

OKP: But aren’t 360 deals more common in the industry these days?

RL: But this was after I’d already built a substantial touring business overseas. So I said, “Look, I’m not really selling many records for you guys anyway. You guys have the Cash Money and Young Money families under your umbrella. You also have Interscope under your umbrella. I’m not really affecting the bottom line. And I’m also being creatively restricted. So it would probably be better to not have the headache of having somebody who is coming in here and pushing for my art everyday. Especially when it really doesn’t affect you guys from a monetary standpoint.” So we parted ways amicably. Les Is More would have been my final album that I (would have) owed Universal. I strongly believe that if I would have stayed within a major distribution system, based on empirical evidence, I would have been strongly encouraged to continue in the musical pathway that had just earned me a Grammy nomination.

OKP: So would Les Is More have been a more compromising album had you still been with a major label?

RL: Look at the videos and listen to the music I’ve done since parting ways. When you listen to records like “Glory,” there’s nothing radio-formatted about it. There’s no real chorus, per se. The chorus is essentially an instrumental melody. And it’s completely live. There isn’t an 808 to be found on it. And then to look at the videos, which are each shot in a different city: Zurich, Los Angeles, Las Vegas, Milan, Paris, New York. Who knows how the record is going to sell. But this is a creative project that, on its face, looks nothing like anything that would be attractive to anyone that had some sort of penchant for the commercialization of the art. And I wouldn’t have it any other way. I just want to make the art that I want to make. Anyone that comes to my live show knows that it comes from a place of real passion and real expression.

OKP: Speaking of the live show, one thing that is readily identifiable about your sound is the merging of synthesis with a strong live band aesthetic, which seems to have waned within the realm of contemporary R&B. How important is it for you to retain that in your music?

RL: It’s very important. Growing up and first starting out in music, I didn’t have any money. I think that’s the case with a lot of emerging musicians. So even though I’d heard sophisticated and proficient instrumental parts, I would have to force myself to find those parts on a synthesizer or keyboard to produce them. When I actually turned in my self-titled record to Tommy Mottola, who was mentoring me through the entire process, he listened to the records and said, “Hey, Ryan. I’ve made some of the biggest records in the world during my tenure at Sony. I know someone who you should get in the studio with.” So he put me in touch with the late Tom "T-Bone" Wolk, who was just an incredible eye-opener for me in terms of layering awesome guitar and bass parts over the record. Up until that point, I had been accustomed to making all my records in an apartment. I made Cassie’s entire album in a one-bedroom apartment in Harlem. I went from that to recording at Sony Studios, showing up in a suit everyday so I could channel Miles Davis and Quincy Jones, and working with Tom "T-Bone" Wolk and David Sancious. I knew that those were the kinds of records that I wanted to make. I didn’t want it to be so much of a huge departure when people come to the live show and I have all these instruments and people say, “Well, that’s not how the record sounds.” I want my records to echo what I envision the live performances to be.

OKP: You’ve managed to cultivate a very robust fan base with little help from the star-maker machinery. How has your online following enabled you to continue on the journey of a solo artist?

RL: I’m definitely fan-funded. I did make some great investments when I was very heavily involved on the songwriting and production side of things. That gave me the start-up capital to get my vision and my independent structure off the ground. But really, I’m fan-funded. The people that come to my concerts and pay double and triple the price of an album to watch the music being performed live is the way that future albums, videos, and tours are going to be funded. I want to give them everything that we possibly can. I know how I felt listening to Michael Jackson’s records. I know how I feel when listening to Stevie Wonder’s records. I know how I feel listening to Jimi Hendrix, The Beatles, Elton John, and the list goes on. If I could create music on that level, why would I rob my generation of it if it’s within my power to collaborate with people to give them that? So I think that I’m extremely grateful and appreciative to the audience that I do have. They follow what I’m doing online in the absence of mainstream distribution. They feel that what I’m offering the culture is valuable enough to spend $20, $30, sometimes upwards of $75 to $100, to come hang out with me during sound check. Take pictures and talk to me. Let me know how they’ve been affected by the music. Also, the investment of the time. Because to come to a concert, it takes 4-5 hours out of your night. You have to get ready. If you want good seats, you wait in line. You wait for the encores. You go out afterwards and have drinks with you friends. So every single person who makes that investment for me, I want to make sure I’m giving them their money’s worth.

OKP: There’s a line in “Glory” that alludes to you not being given your just dues in the industry. Do you feel you’ve been underestimated or underrated as an artist?

RL: I don’t really think that anyone underestimates me as an artist. I don’t think that anyone that has watched my studio sessions or has come to my shows could leave with any questions of whether I’m someone who really loves my craft and has invested the time to become proficient. I think where the estimations really have to be more conservative are with the sales metrics. How many tickets have I actually sold within the United States? Let’s be real. How many records have I actually sold in the United States? Let’s be real. For me to have a Grammy nomination already speaks to the artistic contribution and the respect of my peers for what I’m doing as an artist. I think that when it comes down to money, people are risk-averse. There isn’t any incredible sales record from a ticket standpoint or an album standpoint that says, “Hey! Ryan Leslie’s the man!” (laughs) There isn’t anything that indicates anything to that effect. It’s not like I’m coming off number one albums, number one records, or mega radio smashes that would indicate that a large number of people would want to show up and see the music performed live in concert. Most people in business have to create forecasts based on the metrics that they have to analyze. If you look at my metrics, besides the sold-out domestic run that we just did, I had never toured in the United States – for a variety of reasons. Mostly because people said, “Hey. If this guy doesn’t have records on the radio, how do people know to even come to this show?” I know where I’m currently positioned in the marketplace and I don’t have any issue with it. I know that when the metrics demand more, I will be right there front and center – because I’m self-managed. My team and my executive management team that I’ve put together will demand more as well.

OKP: What do you think creates this misconception?

RL: Because so many people come from the angle of, “All this time, I thought Ryan Leslie was a just a superproducer that never got his just dues because he never worked with the biggest artists.” But that’s not what I feel like I was put on this earth to do. I was put on this earth to play. And that’s what I want to do. I want to deliver the most incredible show that I possibly can. That’s also some of the justification for the evolution of the expression in terms of the rap direction. I know I don’t have a Stevie Wonder voice. I don’t have the dexterity and vocal flexibility of Stevie Wonder or a John Legend. They get on stage and have a spiritual experience when they close their eyes and start singing. I didn’t invest the time to be able to deliver that. But from the standpoint of giving a multi-layered show that integrates rap, singing, playing instruments, arrangements, and lights - I know I do invest that time. I put my band together on Twitter. These are all kids that have never even been on tour before. My guitarist is 20-years-old. He was just shedding in his room. He sent me a You Tube video of him playing “Something That I Like” and “Glory” in his bedroom. And me putting it together and saying, “Look, we’re going to come out here and we’re going to rehearse 3-5 times a week to get this right.” Because there’s a serious passion, dedication, and focus on delivering the best product that we can deliver for everybody’s hard earned money and time. I know that’s kind of long-winded answer to the question.

OKP: So what would be a short-winded answer?

RL: How do I feel about being underestimated? I’m cool with it. Because I don’t have any metrics that indicate that I should be treated any other way than I have been treated. And that’s not to say that I’m being treated poorly at all. I’m living a dream.